CAA: Christian Anime Alliance

blkmage (post: 1411953) wrote:But this was their objective. The biggest problem is that the centralized sites are making money off of their work. The second problem is that it devalues their work. The third problem is that most people who visit OneManga are not the ones who are likely to buy anything.

They know they can't stop scanlations, nor is it in their best interests to stop scanlations completely. However, they also don't want to and can't just let their work be available that easily. And that's what this entire little exercise was. They are making it more difficult. They know that most people don't buy anything and they're just reading it because it's easy. Do you think people who are so lazy that they can't bother to look for scanlations are going to buy anything?

Not to mention the fact that a good chunk of scanlators despise aggregation sites anyway and refuse to let their translations show up on those sites.

Everyone speaks of these sites as if they're the source of scanlations when they're not. These sites are just a convenience. It's not like looking for stuff is hard, it's just more work than going to a site and knowing it's all there. I've gotten used to tracking fansubbing and scanlation groups for so long that I can't see why this would matter in the long run to people who aren't lazy.

I'm not saying they should have left things the way they were. I'm saying they've made it harder to keep track of the problem. They should have waited until they had something ready to supersede the scanlator sites, not just disperse them.

These sites are just a convenience. It's not like looking for stuff is hard, it's just more work than going to a site and knowing it's all there. I've gotten used to tracking fansubbing and scanlation groups for so long that I can't see why this would matter in the long run to people who aren't lazy.

It won't matter. not even to the lazy-est of people, because typing], read, free, and manga into Google is not enough additional work to deter any one, all they've done is spread the hits out.

And how much profit are these sites making? beyond the server costs I mean. It can't be that much.

Are you sure about that? I know several people who are casual readers who have no idea what to do now that OneManga is down. To a lot of people, OneManga is manga, and that's the sort of thing that is toxic for publishers. Also, Google is actually atrociously bad at finding this sort of thing for anything but the most popular series and the most popular sites. And even the most popular series will have a ridiculous amount of false positives, especially using the query you suggested. If I were looking for places to find a new series, I would never use Google.

And you've missed the point of what I'm saying. Scanlators are not the problem. The sites centralizing all of those things are. Scanlators are not the same as aggregators.

OneManga et al. are not altruistic and generous benefactors. They're not going to be running the 352nd most popular site in the world at a loss, and with the amount of page impressions they get per day, they're likely making a profit. Whether that profit is large or small, no one is sure, but that prospect is something that publishers will not and cannot overlook.

Not to mention that they can't wait until they have something to supercede those sites because the most probable case is that they have no intention of having such a thing. Go back and read what I've said about Japanese corporate culture and its propensity for change.

blkmage (post: 1411971) wrote:Are you sure about that? I know several people who are casual readers who have no idea what to do now that OneManga is down. To a lot of people, OneManga is manga, and that's the sort of thing that is toxic for publishers. Also, Google is actually atrociously bad at finding this sort of thing for anything but the most popular series and the most popular sites. And even the most popular series will have a ridiculous amount of false positives, especially using the query you suggested. If I were looking for places to find a new series, I would never use Google.

And you've missed the point of what I'm saying. Scanlators are not the problem. The sites centralizing all of those things are. Scanlators are not the same as aggregators.
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This is true. For some things, Google is very good but with a search like that it would be difficult to find that particular manga.

But even in the long run this isn't going to shut down onemanga-ish type websites. They'll just restart once the witch hunt ends and some will slip under the radar.

I think people need to realize that sites like OneManga aren't there for the fans, they're there for ads.

There are plenty of fan communities out there that host/link scanlations for the fans. I follow one in particular. Usually with these communities the fans buy the manga as its released here but read the scans of the chapters that come out in Japan. Some of them I've seen buy the JP manga directly from Japan and then buy the US versions just because they love the series that much.

Fact is, they care about the success of what series they fan over. Sites like OneManga does not.

I don't mind paying for manga so long as it is available were I live. If the companies posted manga online for a price, I'd like that. Some sort of online manga library that companies hosted and you could use paypall on. They'd make money, so they'd be happy, and fan's who don't have a certasin manga available to them could read online, so they're happy.

I just hope that Naruto ends soon, before EVERY SITE hosting scanlations is down, otherwise I'll never see how it ends. I primarily got into it to have something to talk about with a person at school. It didn't work. I hate not knowing how things end, and my new go-to site after onemanga already dropped everything by Shonen Jump. I found another one, but I don't know HOW long it'll last.

The third problem is that most people who visit OneManga are not the ones who are likely to buy anything.

Well, I certainly would NEVER buy Naruto (the Manga I've been following the most). The only way I'd read it is free. I think it's absurd, that it jumped the shark a long time ago, and I only follow it because I hate not seeing how things end and it made me curious enough to want to know how they tie up a number of loose ends, if they ever do. If I have to wait 4 years and see it (again, for free) at Barnes and Noble, then fine.

If I was in Japan, however, and understood Japanese (or was further along in learning it) I would buy Manga (though still not Naruto or any other Shonen Jump series). It's a DECENT PRICE there. (I'd never buy anime, though. I'd just record it off TV)

Well Bob, there's always the library. It's free and legal.

Libraries are socialist. :p

In seriousness though, the library is a good idea in theory, if you have a good library. If you have a crap library like me, it does no good. My library doesn't carry manga, and it's a pretty small library too, it doesn't even have a whole lot of books. I remember trying to do a report on nuclear power for a class, and the library had only one book about it...written in 1956. So yeah.

And besides, you're kind of at the mercy of what the library wants to carry in terms of manga anyway if your library has it. If you want to read Naruto or Bleach or One Piece, you're probably fine. If you want to read Kamen Rider Spirits, then not so much.

I have a fairly small library and I don't go there much anymore, but it's worked pretty well for me in the past. They had a small collection of manga titles, usually only the first volume of a series. I just told them the books that I was looking for and they did some search to see if any of the other libraries in this branch had those books; they were able to locate them and had them sent out to my library.

I'm not sure if every library will do things like that, but it's worth a try to ask.

My library carries a lot of manga, but I mostly order from other libraries like Cloud said. I'm sorry your library is tiny Nate. Also I see Yen Plus is going online now (like I had hoped for), so fans every where with internet access can read legally for a small fee.

Reading online is how I got into FMA in the first place. Because I loved it so much, I have bought all the volumes out in the U.S. so far. I bought them because I wanted to support the artist/company that made it. But if I had never been able to read it online, I probably wouldn't have gotten into the series.

I was hoping to be able to read the DBZ manga since the anime is really dragging along. And I can't find it at Hastings or other local stores.

But I can understand their position, though.

I second Nate. I live in a small town, and we don't have a bookstore, and our library simply doesn't carry any manga

This is America we shouldn't have to depend upon our government to get our Manga!!! XP
I'd buy mine myself, but it's too expensive for something I'm only going to read once.
I also use to use OneManga because I didn't usually get raunchy adds or pop ups, and it was easy to avoid ecchi and hentai. As was said before, a little more intense internet browsing will get results, but I'd rather go play a video game that I know I like than search for something new to read that I might regret.
If licensers would set up Manga libraries like Funimation's video page, that'd solve my problems... I'm far enough behind anyway, and if I really like something, I can then buy it directly from them. But for all I know they already could've done it...

I just bought a new manga today and it only set me back about $7.50. Now I did have to go to a book store but they also sell books online. I think it's worth the money if you really like the manga. How ever if you don't want to buy it and don't have it in your library, find a friend who does XD

wildpurplechild (post: 1419884) wrote:I just bought a new manga today and it only set me back about $7.50. Now I did have to go to a book store but they also sell books online. I think it's worth the money if you really like the manga. How ever if you don't want to buy it and don't have it in your library, find a friend who does XD

I live in the middle of nowhere, literally. No one besides myself even knows what manga is and my library does not and will not carry manga. Please try to give me an alternative to reading scanlations in order to find out if I even like a series without spending my hard-earned minimum-wage cash. I dare you.

$7.50 isn't much stand-alone but when you consider the fact that most series are at least 10 volumes long or more, that's at least $70. Your statement is like saying "Ha my drink in my lunch order only set me back $1" when your lunch order cost you $10.

CrimsonRyu17 (post: 1419890) wrote:I live in the middle of nowhere, literally. No one besides myself even knows what manga is and my library does not and will not carry manga. Please try to give me an alternative to reading scanlations in order to find out if I even like a series without spending my hard-earned minimum-wage cash. I dare you.

$7.50 isn't much stand-alone but when you consider the fact that most series are at least 10 volumes long or more, that's at least $70. Your statement is like saying "Ha my drink in my lunch order only set me back $1" when your lunch order cost you $10.

I feel your pain.

CrimsonRyu17 (post: 1419890) wrote:I live in the middle of nowhere, literally. No one besides myself even knows what manga is and my library does not and will not carry manga. Please try to give me an alternative to reading scanlations in order to find out if I even like a series without spending my hard-earned minimum-wage cash. I dare you.

$7.50 isn't much stand-alone but when you consider the fact that most series are at least 10 volumes long or more, that's at least $70. Your statement is like saying "Ha my drink in my lunch order only set me back $1" when your lunch order cost you $10.

Does your library have an inter-library loan? The length of many series make it impractical for following series long term, but it's decent enough for sampling a few volumes of a series, and I haven't had any real problems with it if one has patience.

At any rate, the problem these companies are having is not the people that read a series online and then buy it when they like it....it's the people that read all these series online and then never pay a cent for anything, which is unfortunately most people apparently.

Gee then I guess the US company that refused to officially translate and release the manga they licensed (and that I enjoy) shouldn't have done that because now my only option IS to read the series online and never pay a cent for anything.

They can't complain about that kind of crap when they literally give me zero other options.

MasterDias (post: 1420144) wrote:Does your library have an inter-library loan? The length of many series make it impractical for following series long term, but it's decent enough for sampling a few volumes of a series, and I haven't had any real problems with it if one has patience.

I said that it will not and I mean what I say. Rarely if ever will they transfer books even if requested, they don't carry lot of things especially manga or anything foreign and most of the books in there are from the 80's to 90's.

That's...well...I don't really know what to say. If they won't even keep up to date with their books... I don't know how big it actually is but being a smaller library would still not be an excuse for them, since I've seen small libraries that were generally well-maintained.

MasterDias (post: 1420295) wrote:That's...well...I don't really know what to say. If they won't even keep up to date with their books... I don't know how big it actually is but being a smaller library would still not be an excuse for them, since I've seen small libraries that were generally well-maintained.

Depends on how you define "small". My town has a population of 300 and the next town, the one with the library, about 800. The library itself is a single floor small building.

MasterDias (post: 1420295) wrote:That's...well...I don't really know what to say. If they won't even keep up to date with their books... I don't know how big it actually is but being a smaller library would still not be an excuse for them, since I've seen small libraries that were generally well-maintained.

Smaller libraries have an excellent excuse for not having a wide selection of books: very limited space and money.
New books are constantly being published and many of those go on the "best seller lists" and they are what a majority of average readers read. Now, when a library is only limited to a one or two story building on a block or two (as well as being limited by the people who pay for the library to run, aka: taxpayers), it can only hold so many books, so the library has to pick and choose on the books it can add and subtract from its collection (as well as the ones, like reference books and classics that it has to keep) without getting overly packed. Depending on the town, since more people are more likely to read a novel off the best seller list instead of a manga volume (unless it was Naruto, One Piece or Bleach), they would choose to buy the best seller over the manga volume because it would cater to a majority of their readers/supporters.


That being said, concerning the main topic of this thread, I agree with Nate in saying that it was rather silly of US companies to complain about online manga that may never be translated into English and printed in the US. (if Japanese companies had complained, then sure, they have every right to that).
But when it comes to stuff like Naruto and Bleach, those will be released in the states anyways, so it's not a huge loss to not get to read them online (besides the fact you have to wait longer, but whatever).

Yes, but there are still things a library can do even with limited space and money. Take note of the items no one ever checks out, sell those off, and buy new books for example. Even if their primary focus would be on scholarly works or non-fiction, a library that only contains old material would actually be pretty useless for researching most subjects.

MasterDias (post: 1420320) wrote:Yes, but there are still things a library can do even with limited space and money. Take note of the items no one ever checks out, sell those off, and buy new books for example.

They've attempted to do that a few times but didn't make much at all. Probably because not many people want old books.

As much as I've tried to give alternatives to reading online, I have to admit, sometimes I get impatient for stuff to come out in the US, or I like manga that isn't ever coming to America (such as one-shots). I do try to read most of my manga from the library or buying though.